Public Education Matters

Various student voices 0:08
Public education matters. Public education matters. Public education matters.

Scott DiMauro 0:15
This is Public Education Matters brought to you by the Ohio Education Association.

Katie Olmsted 0:20
Thanks for joining us for this edition of Public Education Matters. I'm your host, Katie Olmsted, and I'm part of the communications team for the Ohio Education Association and its nearly 120,000 members across the state. If any of those members visited OEA's website lately, they will have noticed a huge change. That's because the newly designed, streamlined ohea.org is officially up and running. It integrates more seamlessly with the My OEA app for your smartphone or tablet. And not only is ohea.org a lot easier on the eyes now, it's also a lot easier to navigate thanks to improved search features and even some quick links on the home page broken down by the different kinds of members OEA serves. OEA represents everyone from K-12 teachers to education support professionals, higher ed faculty members and more, and one of the big things OEA can help them do is negotiate the strongest contracts possible to ensure Ohio's public school educators can provide the best learning conditions for the students they serve. One of OEA's in house experts on all things collective bargaining is Eric Watson-Urban. He's a Collective Bargaining and Research Consultant in OEA's Education Policy Research and Member Advocacy department, and before that, he was in the field as an OEA Labor Relations Consultant, helping his locals negotiate their contracts at the bargaining table. Eric knows his stuff, and he knows how collective bargaining agreements really can intersect with the laws, new and old, in ways that really impact working conditions for educators in all job areas at all stages of their careers. He joins us now to share his insight on three big issues all locals really need to be thinking about as they're getting ready to sit down at the bargaining table again.

Eric, thank you for sitting down with us today and bringing us your wealth of knowledge. Things sort of change over time, but right now, there are some big things that all the locals should be considering. What can you tell me?

Eric Watson-Urban 2:39
So there are three different subjects I wanted to talk about today. One impacts our later career members with respect to how they can best plan for retirement through the collective bargaining process, continuing contract, which is really for the mid-career and earlier career folks, and then PUMP Act, which is an exciting new law that was passed just a little over a year and a half ago, and we've provided some model language on that, which will impact our young female members, most importantly.

Katie Olmsted 3:10
Alright, so let's dive in. Which one you want to start with?

Eric Watson-Urban 3:13
Let's start with the PUMP Act. So the PUMP Act was passed in December of 2022. President Biden signed the law into effect. And it's unusual in the matter in the way that it impacts our members, because this is actually a Department of Labor law which usually doesn't impact at least our certified members. Our ESP members, obviously fall under the Fair Labor Standards Act and a lot of other things like that. But this law is probably the most broad woman-based piece of legislation that's passed at least in the last 10 years. And what it does is it requires employers, all employers, to provide a safe, wholesome place for mothers who are lactating. And so it's called the PUMP Act, and it covers every one of our members, from bus driver to cook to custodian to teacher, paraprofessional, the whole nine yards.

Katie Olmsted 4:09
And importantly, this was this was a bill that I cared very deeply about as a mom of two young kids and a formerly nursing mom. Before this law went into effect, there were a lot of people who were not covered by the laws that were supposed to protect your right to pump at work.

Eric Watson-Urban 4:26
Right.

Katie Olmsted 4:26
And this really broadens that out.

Eric Watson-Urban 4:28
It does, it does. And the law actually lays out a number of requirements that employers must comply with in order to be considered in compliance with the law. And so, first and foremost, it it requires the employer to give a reasonable break time for anyone to express milk for their nursing child for up to one year after the child's birth. And it is not just at the employer's convenience. It literally is an individual decision. So every human body is different. Their needs are different. And so the law recognizes that, and actually requires in the statute to quote each time an employee has a need to express milk. It is not just simply when it's convenient, like during your planning time or at lunch, before after school or the workday. It literally requires the the employer to have a great deal of flexibility and respect the flexibility needs of its employees.

Katie Olmsted 5:29
And logistically, I think in the past there, that's been a problem. You know, my sisters both are were nursing moms in the classroom, and it's very hard to maintain that pumping schedule when they didn't have that break time, but if they left the classroom to pump, what were they going to do? So this is where the contract can really make a difference.

Eric Watson-Urban 5:49
Absolutely and so, you know, these are all foundation of law, and that's an important thing, that when we talk about bargaining language into a collective bargaining we need to understand first, what the law actually requires, so that we don't ever bargain below our basic rights. And then, on top of that, you know, we try to build, fill in the holes that the statute may or may not actually have created for us in this conversation. And like you said, this, this, there was no, virtually no protections for women in the workplace who were expressing milk prior to this legislation, which is why it is so important to our members. And it goes further than just when you need to, but where to and that has always been an issue. We know that many of our school buildings across the state of Ohio have have empty spaces, and they weren't used appropriately when it comes to expressing milk, so they literally put some of our members in custodial closets or in storage rooms or wherever. And so the law actually goes much further in making it very clear that you must have a private place to pump

Katie Olmsted 6:57
and not a bathroom

Eric Watson-Urban 6:58
Absolutely not a bathroom. The actual statute says, very specifically, that's not to be used as a bathroom.

Katie Olmsted 7:04
Excellent. So that's one. And all of the LRCs have this model language that they can start bargaining into contracts as we move forward, hopefully.

Eric Watson-Urban 7:13
Absolutely, yes. And anybody that has a question about this, they can contact their LRC. We have provided model language which goes above these two basic standards that we've talked about and really gets into the nitty gritty, like, what should this room look like? How big should it be? Should it have water? Should it have plug ins? All of those types of things where the law, as we all know, sometimes the legislature, whether it's state or national, falls a little bit short. That's where the collective bargaining conversation comes into play, and we fill in the parts and pieces that make the most sense for our members at the local level.

Katie Olmsted 7:47
And our members at the local level also have to consider continuing contracts. That's another thing we want to talk about today. What can you tell me?

Eric Watson-Urban 7:55
So continuing contract is often referred to as tenure, and continuing contracts are very, very important to our members, because what do they do? First of all, they take you to a different place on the seniority list. And what I mean by that is the only time that seniority list really applies to members outside of a bidding into a new position type scenario is in a reduction in force, which can obviously be the one of the one of the most traumatic things that anyone goes through in their life, is to be subject to a reduction in force or a layoff. And so the law provides for a very basic level of protections. And when it comes to reduction in force, a continuing contract teacher actually is on a separate seniority list. And so when you have continuing contract, it gives you a higher level of protection. And secondly, and most importantly, is the standard of just cause for termination of your contract. When you're a limited contract teacher, you do not have very many protections in the law, so you really rely on the local collective bargaining agreement to provide things like due process and just cause standards for that non-renewal or termination. But when you get a continuing contract, the law actually has a baseline of you just can't get rid of somebody just because. It literally is just cause, and there has to have be a reason behind the termination of an employee's contract. And so some of the qualifications to get a continuing contract, I think those are important for everybody to understand. And again, the baseline is where we want to make sure we we don't go below the law. The law has some very specific things that need to be included with respect to continuing contracts. So first of all, some of this depends upon whether you were employed, you received your first teaching license before January 11th, 2011 or after January 1, 2011 and we'll get to that distinction in just a minute. So for everyone, regardless of when you got your teaching first teaching license, very first teaching license, there are some requirements in the law. First of all, you have to have a permanent professional life certificate, a five year professional, senior professional or lead professional license. So you can't be under a lesser license than those. You have to have worked in the district three of the last five years. And then you have to have one of two different educational attainments. So if your master's degree was held at the time you initially received your teaching license, then you have to have six semester hours past that master's degree while you're teaching in order to to be eligible for a continuing contract. If you did not hold a Master's Degree at the time you initially received your first teaching license, then you are either getting a master's degree or at least 30 hours past your bachelor's degree once you've received that license. And so the only difference between those that are pre and post January 1, 2011 is the number of years you had had to taught in order to qualify for continuing contracts. So the law passed in 2011, 2010 and basically that's why this January 1 date exists for those that were initially licensed, first teaching license prior to 1/1 of 2011 you only need to have taught for three years in order to be eligible for continuing contract. After that, if you received your first license after January 1 of 2011 you must teach for seven years before you're eligible for a continuing contract.

Katie Olmsted 11:27
And that's what the law says. Yep, when it comes to bargaining around this issue in our contracts, what should we be aiming for?

Eric Watson-Urban 11:33
So we should be aiming for nothing more than what the statute requires. In my experience, both in my current and previous jobs. What we see a lot in contracts is things like, you must apply to get a continuing contract, and those are bargained into contracts. That's usually an employer type scenario, that's in their interests. And the reality is is there's no need. The law is very clear. Once you attain those things and you're at the end of your limited contract, they must consider you for a continuing contract, unless you give them more things that you have to do. Now, one of the things that we should be talking about is, with respect to putting a union sort of provision into the collective bargain agreement, is the ability to break your limited contract. Because of the the cycles of limited contracts in the state now, you can be, you could be eligible for a continuing contract, and met everything, met all the requirements, but you have, you're literally just got your limited contract three months ago. You under the law there, the board is not required to break that limited contract in order to consider your continuing contract status. So you could be up to, you know, two and a half more years under a limited contract before you become eligible for a continuing contract. And so we want to put language in the contract that says, Look, when I'm eligible, at the end of the school year, I should be considered for a continuing contract.

Katie Olmsted 13:00
That's very important advice there. Also advice around retirement issues in our contracts. What do you got for me?

Eric Watson-Urban 13:06
So there's a lot of things to deal with retirement. I know retirement is a hot button issue for folks, and while we have very good provisions in STRS, SERS, and PERS for our members with respect to guaranteeing a certain level of income post-retirement, there are some things that we can actually bargain into contracts that make life much easier. Many of our contracts contain severance payouts. So if I have accrued but unused sick leave, I can usually trade those in at the end of my career, at, you know, a quarter of a day for each day of payment. And what there is a relatively unused provision in the IRS tax code, which is called a special pay plan, and it falls under the 403(b), which all of our employees, members across the country have, or across the state have access to, but it's called the 403(b) Special Pay Plan. And what makes it special is you're able to take that lump sum of money, and for nearly all, if not all of our members, it's going to be the largest check you ever receive from your employer. And if they just write you a check and send it to you, or, you know, electronic deposit it, it's going to be a huge chunk of change. It's all taxable at the time that you receive it, and you're not able to, you know, to defer any tax liability with respect to those. And the special pay plan is designed and must be bargained. So this is one thing that you actually have to bargain into your collective bargain agreement, or you don't have eligibility to it, because the IRS requires certain standards to be met in order for it to be a tax deferred scenario. So the 403(b) special pay plan is designed to capture that money as an employer contribution to your 403(b). Now, why is that important? Well, currently, under IRS law, I can put up to $23,000 into my 403(b) plan, right as an elective deferral From my paycheck every two weeks or in a lump sum. However, I want to do that. But for most folks, particularly teachers, that severance package or that severance payout is more money than that. And so anything that I can't defer under that that limited amount of money becomes taxable income to me at the moment that they write that check. The 403 (b) limit for a Special Pay Plan is $69,000.

Katie Olmsted 15:25
Wow.

Eric Watson-Urban 15:25
So even if I was contributing the very maximum that I could in the final year of my retirement, 23,000, that still gives me rough math, $46,000 that I can defer what otherwise would be a taxable income to me and put it into my 403(b), and pull it out as my needs occur in my retirement. Now, what it does is a couple things. First of all, it it meets all the standards of the IRS Code, so it is a truly transparent transaction. And what it does is it also saves me local taxes, so it's not considered income at that point in most localities, if they have a local income tax, do not tax income received from retirement plans. Specifically, 403(b)s, 457s. It also say allows me to save permanently the Medicare tax that I would have paid otherwise on that payment, because it's not considered income when you leave. And so therefore you don't have to pay any Medicare taxes on it. And that money goes in and it's, it's, it goes in tax free. It grows tax free until you begin to you want to do distributions, and then you pull it out and becomes normal taxable income. Now the reason why this has to be bargained is because it has to apply to everybody. It can't just be an individual choice. So to meet the IRS requirements, it must be applicable to a class. And we've defined the class in our model language as anyone that's age 55 or older in the year in which they retire, which is the first year under IRS law that if I retire in the year that I turn 55, I can begin withdrawing from my 403 (b) without any 10% tax penalties.

Katie Olmsted 17:08
We're talking a big amount of money here, and certainly something that every local should be looking at. Eric, thank you so much for sharing your expertise, so people know where to start from on these things.

Eric Watson-Urban 17:20
My pleasure, my pleasure.

Katie Olmsted 17:25
Now, let's be honest, this conversation with Eric really doesn't even scratch the surface of the many big issues that can and should be part of any conversations around negotiations. Our hope is to have Eric on again to give us some more advice in the future, but we really wanted to keep this conversation under 20 minutes, to keep with the bite sized episode preference so many OEA members said they wanted when they participated in OEA's podcast survey over the summer. In fact, this whole episode was in direct response to that survey, with quite a few of you asking for more practical advice and more content around bargaining. We want to keep delivering what you told us you want, and we will continue to have a wide variety of guests and a wide variety of conversations about the big education issues in our state as season five of this podcast continues, because in Ohio, public education matters.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai